The webinar with Kristin Kobes Du Mez, Beth Allison Barr and me is going to be awesome!
We have 3000 seats available, but 2000 are already gone. So grab your seat now!
On December 6 at 9 pm EST (sorry for all of you in Europe!), the three of us are sitting down with Devi Abraham, host of the Where Do We Go From Here podcast, to talk about our books.
Now, you’ve likely heard all of us talk about our books. You hear me talk about mine all the time. Beth was on the podcast last week, and Kristin was on a few months ago. And we’ve all been all over other people’s podcasts!
But this one is going to be different, because we’ll ALSO be sharing about what we liked about each other’s books. Plus we’ll be talking about what this year has been like personally for us, and where we see things going from here. What changes do we see on the ground?
We’ll have door prizes for those who are there live (including something I handknit, plus some amazing Femallay products!), but you can also listen to the recording afterwards if you can’t listen live.
And we’ll be answering some of your questions as well.
So grab your seat now before they’re gone!
Let’s talk why the webinar is needed: “The best person to rape is your wife”
This is just a tiny incident, one little thing that has happened this year in a slew of other things, but it’s just emblematic of why our books are needed.
On November 13, Dr. Burnett Robinson, pastor of Grand Concourse Seventh Day Adventist Church in the Bronx, was commenting on how marital rape can’t exist because the husband owns his wife’s body. He was bemoaning the laws that make marital rape illegal, and in the middle of all of that, he said, “Gentlemen, the best person to rape is your wife.”
Abuse advocate Sarah McDugal heard about this and grabbed this video before the church took the video of the sermon down.
She contacted several journalists, and the story appeared at Religion News Service and Julie Roys’ site. Because of the pressure, his denomination did put out a statement and placed him on paid administrative leave. (Note that he is still being paid, so it’s kind of like a vacation where he doesn’t need to work, and in the statement they didn’t actually say that marital rape was wrong).
Sarah, in this story, acted like Jael from the Old Testament–and that’s where our “Tea and Tent Pegs” name comes from.
In the Judges 4 account, Deborah is leading Israel, and the enemies of Israel are amassing against them. Barak, the leader of the army, refuses to fight unless Deborah goes with them, and Deborah says she will–but the honor of the day will be taken from Barak and given to a woman.
In the battle, the enemies are routed, and Sisera, the leader of the Canaanites, is trying to escape. He heads down to where he thinks there will be friends–the Kenites. Jael, the wife of a Kenite, beckons him into her tent. He underestimates Jael and thinks he’s safe. And while he is lying down, she takes a tent peg and hammers it through his skull (I didn’t say the story wasn’t gross).
Whenever people talk about “biblical womanhood”, I always picture Jael. Being underestimated was her hidden strength. Plus she was brave, and God used her to defeat the enemies of God’s people.
Women are often underestimated, but I believe that right now, women are being used to take on the enemies of God, those who teach things that are contrary to Jesus. (Now, there are many men in this space as well, and I’m so happy for them! But I’ve simply never seen this many best-selling books being written by women, and this many women speaking up in the news. It just seems like something is happening).
Sarah McDugal has been awesome at bringing awareness to the problems with the book Married Sex by Gary Thomas too.
Here’s part of the review she recently published:
As an abuse and trauma recovery coach for women in the faith community, especially women married to porn and sex addicts, I was very much looking forward to this book. I’d hoped for a balanced, ethical, trauma-informed resource I could recommend. Sadly, Married Sex is anything but recommendable.
Married Sex offers multiple caveats insisting that it is NOT meant for troubled or abusive marriages. That would be good, except that the foundational concepts woven throughout the entire book rely on stories and examples from marriages where there are clearly abusive elements.
Reggie has rage issues – that are never named as abuse, and his wife’s sense of emptiness over being used for angry sex is glossed over. Not one mention that she should have been advised to seek Domestic Violence support, based on the description of Reggie’s patterns of behavior.
Danny is described as completely incapable of hearing his wife say no without feeling rejected as a human and taking it personally as a negative about his core identity. This is a fragile, immature, self-focused perspective that needs therapy, not a healthy example.
Darrell (who advises newly married couples) says he’s surprised that some people are uncomfortable with the idea of regularly having naked night – no clothes allowed after 6pm, except an apron in the kitchen for cooking. (Has he never heard of parenting small children?) And why is it not okay to be not okay with cooking dinner naked?
Vito is an Italian stallion who likes to dominate in bed and play with (at minimum) honor bondage. His wife is described as liking it, because, of course she should…
Porn is approached as something most men do, but sexting him will make him not want to, and also even tho 65% of men watch it – this book isn’t for wives of addicts. But if he does, you should offer more sex, avoid making him feel bad about it, and send him nudies…
And no, we don’t want to read Liam’s sex scene, puzzling as the description may be.
I believe sex is created by God to be a beautiful, healthy, intimate shared experience of safety and trust. I’m not shy to talk about awkward subjects, either. So when I say that sections of Gary’s chapters read like cheap dime store erotica, it’s not because I’m a prude. Clinical, medical, unfiltered – all appropriate. Pornographic, scintillating, gratuitous commentary – disturbing.
Gary’s tantalizing descriptions of his wife’s nipples, her body insecurities, her short little legs, her reticence to be seen nude – all smack of shameless exploitation. Especially when juxtaposed against the consistent theme of how good wives should definitely sleep naked, flirt naked, cook naked, send naked pictures, etc.
…
Sexting your husband (especially if he’s the kind of guy who is begging you to) is not only unsafe in a digitally complex world, it’s also definitely NOT going to rewire his brain to be uninterested in p*rn.
Flashing your breasts will not reset power imbalances. And it’s profoundly disturbing that the baseline assumption is that marriage automatically brings power imbalances that would need to be reset. Healthy marriage isn’t about either spouse flexing power over the other, it’s about mutually supporting and protecting each other. (And if you’re in an abusive power-over marriage dynamic, a boob-glimpse is definitely not the solution to reset anything.)
She also put out a video with her review if you’d rather watch the whole thing!
Rebecca and I will attempt to write a review later of Married Sex–it’s hard to put down all our thoughts in a few words, but we’ll try when things calm down with Rebecca’s newborn!
But this year we’ve been so encouraged by partnerships with people like Sarah, but also Andrew Bauman, Gretchen Baskerville, Anne Blythe from Betrayal Trauma Recovery, Gretchen Baskerville, Patrick Weaver, and more who have been very vocal on social media about the need for healthy marriage and sex resources–and calling out those that are harmful, including books like Love & Respect (that’s one that is close to Gretchen’s heart!).
So we decided that we’d do a SECOND webinar that week, with me moderating, and these wonderful people appearing as panelists.
Quite frankly, it’s been an emotional year for those of us who want to call the church to healthy advice focusing on wholeness. There have been a lot of disappointments and evidence that we’re not being listened to. But then there have also been victories. We feel as if the ground is shifting.
So on December 9 and 9 pm (yes, it will be a busy week for me–Monday and Thursday!), we’ll do a webinar on how The Tide Has Turned–a lament for the advice that has hurt the evangelical community, a celebration of some victories, and a look at what’s coming ahead, and how we can all be part of calling the church to more.
I don’t think the world is prepared for all the Jaels that are coming out of the woodwork! So let’s lament. Let’s celebrate. And let’s brainstorm together.
Again, the webinar will be recorded for those who can’t make it live, but live you’ll be able to ask questions!
I know a lot of you are busy with family stuff for the rest of the week, so I wanted to do a post with a round-up of announcements!
I would have taken off tomorrow (which is American Thanksgiving; why do you all do it so close to Christmas?), but we have a great podcast that I want to put up as usual, so I thought I’d do my announcements today. And I did have a number of things to share.
Both webinars are going to be amazing, and I hope you can make them!
One of the things Sarah was remarking when I sent her the graphic for ours was that it brought tears to her eyes, because a year ago we were all doing this alone. Now we’re together. We’re friends. We’ve made relationships. And our voices are getting collectively louder.
That’s how I feel about Kristin and Beth too. All of our books came out in the same year, and all became bestsellers, and all deal with the same topic, but from a different angle (politics; history; marriage). None of us knew the other was working on it until they were almost out. But they all go together so well.
We’re not alone anymore. And I hope I can introduce you to some other amazing people over the course of these two webinars!
Sheila Wray Gregoire
Founder of To Love, Honor and Vacuum
Related Posts
These Books Would Have Changed Our Lives
If we had had these Great Sex Guides before we got married, there would be no Great Sex Rescue. No...
On Vipers in Diapers, Emotional Enmeshment, and Toxic Churches
Dads shouldn't need their adult daughters to give them adulation and affection. That's called...
The Uncomfortable Truth about Waiting until You’re Married for Sex
Growing up, we hear, over and over again: "Just wait for the wedding night! The wedding night will...
Is Someone Stepping on Your Air Hose?
So many women--and many men as well--honestly feel like the church is hurting them. I do not...
Can Sex Be Hot and Holy at the Same Time?
Can sex be hot and holy at the same time? One of my big picture passions that I want people to...
Who I WON’T Be Calling Out for Bad Teachings–But I’m Grateful You Are!
This week, as we've celebrated one year of The Great Sex Rescue, I've received some amazing...
When Going to Church Leads to Worse Outcomes for Teen Girls
On almost every measure, church attendance is good for you. Researchers have consistently found...
Echoes of Menstruation: Spoken Word Poetry
Let's talk about the echoes of menstruation. Yesterday on the podcast, we were discussing how...
Cooking unclothed to some degree, let alone completely, is dangerous! I’m a clumsy person and I burned my baby bump several times, and it hurt!
And as far as American holidays, i always love it, because it’s a 2month time of celebration. My mom’s birthday and mine +1 brother, are all in this 2 month period. We just do tons of family things and Thanksgiving is like the starting line. Every year, since my mom’s midlife Crisis, the celebration gets more and more fun!
But this year will be different 😐
They had Corona and today is the last day of quarantine. So thanksgiving will be delayed a week. I’ve been going stir crazy waiting for them to recover!
Yeah, I think cooking naked is super weird.
I’m sorry about your family! (But I still think October Thanksgiving is a better idea!).
Not just super-weird but also very unhygienic. I wouldn’t want to visit people who regularly did this – I mean, they’ll be sitting naked on their chairs, potentially leaving ‘stuff’ behind… No. Just no!
There are many things that no one should do naked and cooking is one of them. Just ew! There’s a Seinfeld episode when the characters did normal things around the house naked and it was funny.
I love the idea as Jael as a model for “biblical womanhood.” Funny how people never mention her.
I saw the piece on Julie Roys’ site about the pastor encouraging marital rape. I immediately thought of your work. This is why it’s needed, people! There are still pastors who, in 2021, post MeToo, knowing they are being recorded and put on the internet, will still say this #?^~.
To be fair, it sounded like his denomination put the kibosh on his nonsense pretty quickly. At least he’s on “administrative leave” according to the article.
For me this raises the question-what does restoration in a case like this look like? In the past, I think a lot of people who have said or done embarrassing things like this get a slap on the wrist, announce they have “repented,” and go back to business as usual. If the conversation is truly shifting and this sort of misogyny is becoming unacceptable, what is the next step? Can church culture grow to truly hold pastors lovingly accountable? I’m really not sure we have the guts for it.
I don’t think he should be allowed back in the pulpit to be honest. No woman could feel safe with him. And even if he did take a ton of classes to understand better–why not simply hire a pastor who didn’t believe this garbage in the first place? I believe that saying what he did completely disqualified him from ministry.
I don’t think he should ever be a pastor either. No one has a right to be a pastor. It’s over. You can be forgiven without having access to people in the name of the church.
This was so disturbing.
I don’t disagree with you. “Out of the fullness of the heart the mouth speaks.”
No matter how he tried to walk it back, no matter what apology he gave, I wouldn’t trust a man who had espoused such things in a pastoral role. Not because I think men can’t change, but because I don’t trust church structures that much.
There have been way too many people “forgiven” too quickly and “restored” to ministry without real change. There is no incentive for a pastor to do the deep work needed to really confront his own sin and bias.
I’m wondering if it is possible for church culture to mature such that there is an incentive, the means to walk people through, and the gumption to kick ‘em out if they won’t do it. I still don’t know that such a person could be in a pulpit again even then. But they definitely can’t now, IMO.
Yeah, as I’ve been following the updates on the soon to start trial for josh duggar, a lot of information is finally coming out. It highlights the need for individuals and churches to not be wrapped up in publicity and fame.(local, national or international)
Turns out whenever a church(or person) tried to lay down a boundary for dealing with josh and their decision to go on tv, they jumped ship to another church. Taking along a cult like following of families.
Story after story is coming out, of people trying to intervene and stop the trainwreck, but even with law enforcement and cps, it was allowed to continue.
If we just made an effort to stay completely humble, it would likely make a big difference.
That’s why pastors like Mark Driscoll who have no business continuing in ministry are still being platformed. After hearing about that Seventh Day Adventist pastor, Driscoll doesn’t seem nearly as bad, but I still don’t think he should be platformed and allowed to speak at marriage conferences anymore. That other pastor should never be allowed in the pulpit again.
Completely agree. But I’d add that Driscoll should never be allowed in a pulpit again either.
The ‘best’ person to rape is your wife?!!!!!!!
Quite apart from his ‘no such thing as marital rape’ belief, saying that your wife is ‘the best’ person to rape means, by definition, that there are OTHER people it is ok to rape – they’re just not ‘the best’ people to rape.
Whether he realises it or not, what he has just said from the pulpit, AS PART OF HIS SERMON, is ‘men, raping women is ok. But the best woman to rape is your wife’.
Never mind asking what this guy is doing in the pulpit – I want to know what he is doing outside of a sex offender’s prison. Because over here, he would probably be up in court for inciting sexual violence against women.
I know. It’s disgusting.
“Whether he realizes it or not.” There’s no excuse anymore for “not realizing” marital rape is wrong.
Where is “over here?” It sounds nice.
I wasn’t excusing his stance on marital rape – what I was trying to point out was that his words are actually telling people it is ok to rape your wife AND to rape other women. Just that your wife is the ‘best’ option! Which means that even if he’s speaking in a place where marital rape is still lawful (sadly, quite a few countries, and I think I’m right in thinking it’s also lawful in some US states?) he could still be charged with inciting his congregation to commit sexual violence against other women.
I’m in the UK. In many ways, we’re no better than the States, but there has been a move recently to give women more protection against harassment & abuse. Some things which women have been expected to ‘put up with’ for decades are now illegal, and there have been cases where people inciting others to rape have been arrested and charged. At the very least, he’d be questioned by the police for making that comment over here. Although I have no doubt he’d be playing it as ‘persecution for speaking the truth’.
Anon, I didn’t think you were trying to excuse him at all. I intended to reinforce the point that people should be held responsible for teaching things like this, whether they realize the full implications of their words or not.
I don’t think laws like that could pass in the US, and of course laws on their own don’t fix these issues. But it would be a step in the right direction.
In marriage vows, the couple promises to ‘forsake all others as long as you both shall live,’ in other words, your spouse will be your only sexual partner. They also promise ‘to love and to cherish’ which at times will mean not having sex because that is how best to show your love for your spouse at that moment.
PS Hoping to wake up early to join you with my hot water and lemon. It will be four in the morning for me.
Exactly. Human beings “belonging” to one another is exactly about that-love and cherishing. The last line of the video there is really telling. “I don’t understand how you belong to somebody and…” [trails off, possibly realizing he has just said too much].
I think it’s in the screwtape letters where cs Lewis talks about how “useful” it is (from a demonic perspective) to conflate different senses of possession. “My boots,” “my dog,” “my wife,” and “my God” all use the same word, “my,” but mean something very different in terms of the relationship. Flattening these meanings so everything “mine” is like “my boots” legitimizes treating people like possessions. That’s what is happening here. Wife = boots.
Yes, and you notice how it’s all about wives belonging to their husbands – nothing about belonging to each other!
Yes. Even though 1Cor7:4, which people point to to justify this kind of thinking, is symmetrical, addressing both men and women on an equal footing.
> > “Gentlemen, the best person to rape is your wife.”
Wow. There are no words
Was thinking about the “your body isn’t your own” idea as my (young) kids were cozying up to me at lunch today.
I can only speak for myself, but as a mother of young children, *I already know this.* Particularly during the newborn and nursing stages, my sleep wasn’t my own, my time wasn’t my own, my body wasn’t my own because it was needed to feed my child and sometimes was the only thing that would sooth a crying baby. I willingly gave up my “rights” to my body for the sake of my helpless children.
But even with my kids, I am slowly reclaiming my “rights” to my body, like my right to have my lap to myself when I eat a meal, because this is part of the process of establishing a more mature relationship with my children as they grow.
Unless a husband wants to be thought of as nothing more than a big baby, he needs to start acting like an adult towards his wife, and not as another of her children.
An update on the rogue Adventist pastor advocating rape in marriage.
He has resigned.
https://www.nadadventist.org/news/update-greater-new-york-conference-issues-statement-regarding-resignation-grand-concourse
I’m glad he’s gone so that he can’t abuse his position any more (although I suspect there may be other churches that will be ready to hire him – I hope I’m wrong, but I fear I’m right). But the church statement doesn’t really answer the biggest problem – that their pastor thought his comment was an appropriate thing to say.
I’m not saying that the leadership of that church think rape is ok. But for him to even think for a single moment that he could get away with that remark indicates that the church does not have the view of women that it should have.
The best person to rape is your wife.
Well I figured I could make fun of this.
Ahem.
You better check yourself before you wreck yourself.
Check yourself before you wreck yourself
Truth bombs to ya moms
Femally and lipbalm
Singing like its the song of songs
Busting out like a jael
Cause tentpegs to the brain aint good for yo health.
🤣🤣🤣 this is great
Thanks, Codec, for lightening the mood! 😉😉😉
(Oh, and what’s the tune? Or is it just bebopping?)
Ice Cube. Check Yourself.
Might try Wutang next.
Well you seemed to like my song parody so I looked up the lyrics and I am making a full one.
Jael-in style aint nothing to scott at.
(To the music of Mystery of Chessboxing)
Healthy romance is like a swordfight.
You must think before you move.
Jael-in style is immensly strong.
Immune to the enemies weapons
When its properly used its almost invincible.
Raw im a give it to ya
Valid statistics no trivia
Raw statistics from 20,000 women in America
My findings gonna shock the nation.
Like Moses bout to make a proclamation.
Bad philosophies
C.S Lewis Billy Graham knock em on their head
Obligation sex might as well slug your libido its dead
Im pushing the word
Its not my vision your doubtin
Im reiterating principles from a sermon mountain.
People be liars
Stoking bad ideas with fire.
Healthy romance varies
Morticia and Gomez Sally and Harry
I use Jael-lin son.
And where my message from.
Its commin with a vengance
Enough eating crumbs
So if you want to know what your missin
Pay atention
Misuse Saint Paul get roasted in the comment section.
Dont talk the talk
If your words gonna make folks balk
Bad ideas get outlined in chalk
Im mad perplexed
Its what pornified relating made me
Rewire my brain hope women dont hate me.
Transformed wife hitting like a drunk 18 wheeler no surviving
Enough of every mans battle i want to be thriving.
Rough like unwanted stares
Yeah
Lots of christian men confused out there.
Peace to all the kooks
All the people who think they got bad looks
Lot of baggage, shame
Gospel more than a book
We got get some TLC
Aretha RESPECT
Do UC
Bad messages been handed out like bad 80s dnd chick tracts
Every mans battle making me feel like a failure though.
Cause i got mood drops
Not always winning yo
I got beef with people who want to treat me
Like a baby who needs eye candy
Straight misandry or misogony dont even bother
Folks got enough issues not hsving a good figure thats a father.
Hey folks where you with me where you at
Sitting at church in the middle in the back
Hey folks where you with me where you at
Sitting in church in the middle in the back
Here I go
With this flow
Marquis de sade surprised by some of these new lows.
Im dropping mad truth BOOM
Warming up a little bit
Rappin is happening
Deep up the praying then
Hand clap hallalujin
Christ in the business of changing somebodies
Respect yo body
Preach a good word with strength
To the bone. Enter the Jael-in zone
Sho enuff
Tent peg bad stuff
Rough
Peanut butter to the jelly
Jelly jam. Commig at ya
Mad rhymes
Hardcore
People want to know what i got in store
Listening to me
Trying to be more like J.C
Aslan. He roar.
In order to enter the Jael-in
Its more than just bringing slang
Represent godly men and women.
Introducing Sheila Way Gregoire.
My people where you with me where ya at
Sitting at church in the middle in the back.
My people where you with me where you at.
Sitting at church in the middle in the back.
Speaking of the devil, psych
No its God wanting you to live right
Mega strife and yo Jesus died to save ya life
On the mic pastors be saying mad sin
They reneg, but have they really repented?
Half baked theories of romancing and nice masks
But they aint Mamen Rider kicked down Shocker natch
Remember that?
Pastors supposed to be the hero like Samurai Jack.
Bad ideas hitting like a spiked bat.
And for some reason you calling it crazy
That advice shouldnt be scientifically biblicly lazy.
Yo, nobody budge while i shoot hot slugs
But Jesus say pharisiacle cups full of sludge.
Im running with imperfect mugs, like a program getting out bugs.
So grab ya plus one.
Start praying and playing
Its getting late got the bed cant see the sun.
Jael- Jail-Lin
Marital rape is illegal but plenty got messed up see.
Nothing justifies this sin see
The master of the rapture he coming back one day and hes trying to get at ya.
Golden rule is your ABC
Sin the XOXO killer
Looks like the works of its master
Evidence indicates that sin is of odd stature
Merciless like a thief in the night hard to capture.
No cool
Changes like a chameleon
Plays like a friend stabs you with a dagger
Who picks up the pieces ss you cry and stagger?
Jael-lin attacks the sin system
Breaking down lies, Atatata like Hokuto Shinken
You Scream
Poison ideas becleaving your bloodstream
Erupting from ya brain the pain as you seek to retrain reframe
Moving on like a Amos Cascading
And injures
Sinful Pretenders
My peoples wjere you with me where you at. In the church in the middle in the back.
My peoples where you with me where you at? In the church sitting in the middle in the back.
And immune to Satans weapons
When its properly used its almost invincible
Jael-Lin style in incredible strong
And immune to the enemies weapons.
When its properly used its almost invincible.
When its properly used.
I don’t know the music but man this is 24k GOLD. Do you post anywhere I want to hear this so bad now
Crazy as it soubds, but this is the first time i have ever written done an entire parody song.
I am glad folks dig it.
Oh, wow. this is amazing! Wow. I can’t believe you wrote all that! Well done!
“Transformed wife hitting like a drunk 18 wheeler” oh my goodness. This is so good. Thank you so much! Now I just need to get someone to actually rap it….
I am sure that if you send this out to fans that they will and can do it.
Put That on a shirt.
First time writing an entire song parody
I am signed up for the tea and tent pegs webinar. But I cannot be there for the Tide has Turned webinar on December 9. Should I go ahead and say I want a seat so that I will have access to rewatch it later or will that be available later on your site here?
I’ll likely make it available for my email subscribers? But it’s hard to say; I haven’t asked everyone’s permission yet who is speaking! So go ahead and reserve a seat if you think you want to watch it!
It is so much a God-thing that The Great Sex Rescue, The Making of Biblical Womanhood, and Jesus and John Wayne have come out around the same time! Last year around the US presidential elections, I could not shake the feeling how things felt off with so many American Christians determined to keep Trump in office and all these “Trump prophecies” spread throughout social media that I just felt troubled by what I now know is Christian nationalism. While trying to find resources to answer my questions, I somehow came across Jesus and John Wayne which I listened to on audio and my mother read, more things opened up for me and I came across The Making of Biblical Womanhood and TLHV blog and TGSR.
None of these were coincidences at all. I believe God led me to these resources which have helped me understand how our society and church have gotten so far away from Jesus’ teachings and His love for all humans. I felt troubled with this Christian nationalism in America and the way the church has treated women, but I felt alone in my thoughts because a lot of Christians around me made Christian nationalism and complementarianism (I didn’t even know that was a word until reading TMBW) seem to be the right and only way to believe. I could not express my concerns about the way a lot of Christians have behaved regarding politics and that they still believed that husbands should remain in charge.
Now, more than ever, I feel reassured that I’m not alone in my thoughts and am beyond grateful that God has led me here.